Brother, I am literally asking what other meaning "evening and morning" could have? What other meaning they have shown to have had in other instances in Scripture? Or perhaps historical documents from the same era?
When you say: "
Idiom is also a synonym for dialect, a way of speech particular to a geographical area that has specific vocabulary, syntax, and grammar. Finally, it can be used to describe a method of expression particular to a person, time period, or object." (bolded by yourself)
how does that fit in our discussion of the regular understanding of "day" as it is described by "evening and morning" being the normal understanding of ~24 hours of rotation on the earth's axis?
I am genuinely confused because you first said you wondered whether "evening and morning" were idioms. Which suggested (at first) that you were inclined to an indefinite time period for the creation days.
Later, your meaning of idiom became clearer, but your purpose for posting became less clear. If I can go back to one of your earlier posts:
I think "morning and evening" meant a "day" to the Hebrews and it is used as such.
I liked this and was poised to like this post as a whole here.
but the point I'm making that "Someone might argue, in other words, that "morning and evening" seem strange if the sun isn't created yet" is that some, indeed, do argue that very point since "morning and evening" is used preceding the creation of the sun.
Then - at this point - I was confused again. I still do not know what your position is here if "evening and morning" means a day and is used as such, why would anyone have the reasonable ability to argue that the sun is what
makes the day rather than
marks the day?
Before you say that is not your intent, it seems to me that is a direct implication of the statement here. If I am inferring incorrectly, please clarify.
For instance, the Hebrews mark years differently than we do and a King could have been in his "second year" of rule even if he only reigned for a month because time was marked by the turning of the year rather than counting "whole years". It's not that the term "year" is unrelated to a time span but it is a way of marking time and using an idiom that we don't use and so a person who doesn't understand that usage may not realize how long a king actually ruled. That's also true of how days were marked.
I have read about the "year" as you have described it here yet I still do not understand how that would affect the understanding of "evening and morning" in how the Hebrews marked days? How does this fact help us in Gen. 1, please?
It doesn't matter, then, that there's no sun to mark the passage of time.
Here I was unsure if you then agreed with literal 24 hour days? When reading you further, you say
The point in affirming it as an idiom actually guards against ways to see the inclusion of those terms in isolation without considering the significance of how taken together, they communicate something definitive to the writer and original audience.
Yes ok. This is why I am asking my questions. What is being communicated definitively to the writer and original audience within the grammar/culture that a normal person in 2023 America does not grasp?
When further examples were not forthcoming, I then was asking across Scripture and genres (poetry, history, prophecy etc) if there were other grammatical clues in the rest of the OT that you were aware of regarding "days" as relates to "evening and morning" that illustrates your definition of idiomatic usage that may shed light on Gen. 1?
I am literally asking. Genuinely. I always have been.
What is disheartening are the following comments:
I have a Seminary degree. I'm noting this because I have been formally trained over five grueling Semesters on language, exegesis, and hermeneutics.
please take up a few books
it is wearisome to keep being challenged on the basic point by those who are missing the basic point. If asked, rather than challenged and "schooled", I might have explained this but I repeatedly find myself in the way of those who are not asking but trying to instruct me about points I'm not making.
Allowing for charitable reading and assuming the best, I fully believe you are not "pulling rank" here. I write these remarks off as simply sage advice for all of us to keep learning more in this age of free information.
What I would ask is that the same charity be extended to others and maybe not everyone posting here is trying to "school" you or "instruct you in points you are not making"?
Thanks in advance. God bless you.