I am going to have to take a trip with a free grace "Believer" no sure what they believe

[jckdymond55]

Besides (once saved-Always saved) Any good resources on rebuttal for free-grace theology?

 

[Ryan&Amber2013]

I'm not sure, but it doesn't sound like the best trip if you're planning on debating theology, lol. I would probably try to focus on what you have in common.

 

[iainduguid]

It's usually best to ask a person what they personally believe, rather than relying on stock images of their position from someone else. Some people will have all kinds of odd ideas about you, if they know you are a "Calvinist" but have sourced their information about Calvinism from the internet. By asking them about what they believe, you can get a clearer picture not only of what they believe, but how much they know about theology and the Bible, how committed they are to their position, and so on, rather than making assumptions.

 

[ZackF]

It's usually best to ask a person what they personally believe, rather than relying on stock images of their position from someone else.

Wonderful! You often see people answer nominal and ethnic Roman Catholics in a blanketed, similar way. It is often more sensible, effective, and respectful to ask what the person believes and what Father Bob at the local parish preaches about than quoting Tridentine documents.

 

[AgentWillis]

Just don't go cage-stage. That's something I'm still a bit convicted over. I still have much to learn.

 

[retroGRAD3]

Just don't go cage-stage. That's something I'm still a bit convicted over. I still have much to learn.

I would second this. However, don't be surprised if they are in a "cage stage" themselves. They could be very anti-calvinist and want to let you know about it. Don't take it personally. You only really need to say something if they are straight up mocking God (e.g. his sovereignty). Even then, do it with grace and charity.

 

[TylerRay]

Besides (once saved-Always saved) Any good resources on rebuttal for free-grace theology?

Can you explain what you mean by 'free-grace theology?' I've interacted with a lot of viewpoints over the years, but that's not a term I remember coming across. Is it a synonym for antinomianism?

As someone who is very jealous for the freeness of both the gift and the offer of salvation, I'd be interested to know what is lacking in the soteriology of so-called 'free-grace theology.'

Ditto on @iainduguid's advice.

 

[arapahoepark]

Can you explain what you mean by 'free-grace theology?' I've interacted with a lot of viewpoints over the years, but that's not a term I remember coming across. Is it a synonym for antinomianism?

As someone who is very jealous for the freeness of both the gift and the offer of salvation, I'd be interested to know what is lacking in the soteriology of so-called 'free-grace theology.'

Ditto on @iainduguid's advice.

Yes. It's basically what the Lordship Salvation people were against.
Faith alone with no repentance, so yes antinomianism.

 

[TylerRay]

Yes. It's basically what the Lordship Salvation people were against.
Faith alone with no repentance, so yes antinomianism.

Gotcha.

@jckdymond55 - I'd suggest two basic approaches:

1. Point out Christ's clear statement of the absolute necessity of repentance/obedience/following him. Luke 14:25-33 is a good place to start. Jesus is emphatic: 'whosoever doth not bear his cross, and come after me, cannot be my disciple.' Mark 8:34-38 is another good one--he makes it clear that the one who does not live a life of repentance, crossbearing, and discipleship will lose his soul.

2. If salvation does not include sanctification, Christ doesn't actually save his people from their sins. He may save them from punishment, but the dominion of sin remains. This isn't the picture the Scriptures paint, though. 'How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?' (Rom 6:2). The believer has this promise: 'sin shall not have dominion over you' (Rom 6:14). Sanctification is not merely believers obeying God--it is Christ causing them to bear fruit. Sanctification is God's work. Jesus teaches that 'a good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit' (Matt 7:18). Remember the word to Joseph: ' thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins' (Matt 1:21).

Avoid references to the Lordship savation controvery. It will only stir up loyalty to teachers and movements. Besides, both sides muddy the waters. Stick with the Scriptures.

edit: One more thought. emphasise the freeness of grace. Nobody believes in free grace so much as Calvinists do. The unfailing effect of that free grace is holiness.

 

[Stargazer65]

If salvation does not include sanctification, Christ doesn't actually save his people from their sins. He may save them from punishment, but the dominion of sin remains. This isn't the picture the Scriptures paint, though. 'How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?' (Rom 6:2). The believer has this promise: 'sin shall not have dominion over you' (Rom 6:14). Sanctification is not merely believers obeying God--it is Christ causing them to bear fruit. Sanctification is God's work. Jesus teaches that 'a good tree cannot bring forth evil fruit' (Matt 7:18). Remember the word to Joseph: ' thou shalt call his name Jesus: for he shall save his people from their sins' (Matt 1:21).

I like this line of thought. But how do you answer the "Whatabout's"? i.e. whatabout when a good tree DOES bring forth evil fruit?

I usually would bring up that we are talking about the pattern of one's life, not individual acts. An apple tree doesn't always have apples, but throughout it's life it will produce apples, otherwise it's not an apple tree. Is that what Matt 7:18 is talking about?